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Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
By:Dawood, USA
Date: Wednesday, 19 July 2017, 10:55 pm
In Response To: Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd (jawaid ahmed,uk)

You wrote: “Brother Dawood, you recall how I disagree over taking verses out of context and putting these together with other verses or part verses? Yes?”

Yes, brother I fully adhere to and support the idea that no conclusions are valid out of context. However, putting some verses together with others does not mean to go against the context, rather it is a well-established methodology of tasreef-ul-ayaat. One needs to understand what is being said, how it is said, which direction it relates to, which connotations it may bring forward, which are the other words next to it, so on and so forth.

Second, there is no doubt that the book was revealed to prophet in small portions as and when needed. The entire Quran was not complete for about 23 years. Thus, this assertion of yours “A full reading of the Quran is essential for someone to know…” is only partially true, else one has to admit even prophet did not know the commands for good 23 years? To begin with, most commands were related to oneness of God, belief in Him, His attributes, etc. No sane person can ask you to do something until unless you agree to serve him/her. God could not have asked the exalted prophet to go and “establish” a so called system without perfecting his Eman. But I digress.

You wrote: “I agree with this verse that reading of the Quran is linked to salat.”

It is not only linked to Salat, rather the revelation whatever was at the time was needed to be read in Salat. The word Talu (tā lām wāw) used in 29:45 along with other words next to this word are important to understand what is being said. When this word is linked with Alaikum/alaiha etc, it means to read for you, for someone to follow it. When it is linked with Salat, it means to be read in salat/prayer. When this word is used in isolation, it could mean both reading individually for oneself or in a group for others. There maybe one odd usages I may have missed, you can check.

You wrote: “A soldier needs instructions from superior officers to go out and fight; going out and fighting cannot be done with the soldier repeating Vande Mataram and not knowing what to do or where to go. A full reading of the Quran is essential for someone to know what are the commands, principles etc that Allah wants us to live by. A Namaz ritual, repeating the same words does not do this.”

Very true. But a soldier may not even fight and sacrifice his life if he does not believe in the cause, or his belief is weak, or he oversteps his boundaries not because no instructions were given to him but because he knew he would not be held accountable for his actions, etc. etc. Salat and only Salat with understanding can bring an end to all such scenarios.

Your problem is you look at what people do today and conclude the fault lies with the original concept and ideas and not with the people. You ought to dive deep into the Quran to know what this Salat is, what its purpose, how did it function and continue to function, etc.

You wrote: “Reciting in 29:45 is linked to avoiding the wrong results that has happened to past nations as well as reading what the Quran to others so that they will know the truthy. In the middle of this context we have salat which incorporates both these situations which namaz does not do in the slightest.”

Untenable linkages and wrong conclusions. The context of Ibrahim, Lot, Shoaib and their people ends at 29:44, linking the examples of the previous people with those of knowledge in 29:43 and then with believers in 29:44. 29:45 is a singular directive to prophet himself which only asking him to do this: Recite what is revealed of the book to you and stand to pray. Thus, it is not for others at this stage, rather for prophet himself to do it. There is no indication “to establish” any system as you claim. For others is in verse 29:51, here no Salat is mentioned.

Further, continuing onward, 29:48 clearly indicating that not only these verses are early revealed ones, prophet was not used to recite any book before this revelation nor wrote one with his hand.

Best Regards
Dawood

Messages In This Thread

Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
Dawood, USA -- Monday, 17 July 2017, 11:59 pm
Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
jawaid ahmed,uk -- Tuesday, 18 July 2017, 11:34 am
Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
Dawood, USA -- Wednesday, 19 July 2017, 10:55 pm
Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
jawaid ahmed,uk -- Thursday, 20 July 2017, 2:22 pm
Re: Salat 1 to 5: One Salat cont'd
Dawood, USA -- Thursday, 20 July 2017, 10:17 pm